Accident!!

[hybridbear]

Last night my wife & I were stopped at a traffic light and got rear-ended. Does anyone else have experience with this type of accident in the FFE? What will I need to keep in mind when finding a repair shop? What was the tan plastic piece that shattered, causing all the tan plastic to be on the ground under the car?

The woman who hit us told us that she had been fasting for her religion and thus was feeling faint before the accident. She says she was slowing down for the red light and then doesn't know what happened after that. We estimate she hit us at about 20-30 MPH. Fortunately, I had stopped far enough back from the car in front of us that we didn't hit that car even though the impact moved us forward more than 5 feet.











Her car wasn't damaged much, and based on her comments and the volume of other dents/scratches on it she doesn't plan to have it repaired. And her Highlander is new! It's a 2013! And it's already filled with scratches & dents.

 

[hybridbear]

Something else I thought of. How much concern do I need to have over the fact that this is a leased car and the diminished value now because of the accident?

 

[hybridbear]

One thing that certainly helped us is the weight of the FFE. Its curb weight is listed at 3624 lbs. The Highlander is listed at 3946 lbs. For comparison, a gas Focus weighs 2960 lbs & the FFH weighs 3615 lbs.

 

[jmueller065]

(I had mine weighed: 3620 lbs)

I'd crawl under and take some pictures of the underside behind the bumper; someone else around here can also take pics that you can compare with.

Bummer..strangely enough we saw a rear-end accident as it happened on Friday. We were on the highway and the traffic got all jammed up. A guy in a Crown Vic was busy watching the guy on the side of the road change his tire and plowed right into the back of a late model Escape. The delta on that one had to be 30 or more mph. The hood on the Crown Vic bent up... We we're about two car-lengths behind.. I had to gingerly drive through the debris to continue on.

Glad to hear your accident wasn't that bad...

 

[jeffand]

At about 15 to 20 mph impacts and higher will deploy the air bags. Check the rear hatch for proper fit. The light colored plastic looks like it is part that supports the upper part of the plastic bumper cover. You will need to look at the steel bumper to see if has moved. If the car did hit high on the bumper it may have missed the steel beam crushed the plastic. This leaves the hatch more likely to get hit.

 

[michael]

I would just go to a very high quality body shop, let them make the determination. The other driver's insurance should pay whatever it takes to get your car back to 100%.

Diminished value is not your worry if the car is leased.

 

[v_traveller]

Doh!!! What a pain. Hope you are okay...

Assuming you have a Ford lease, I'd recommend taking your FFE to a reputable Ford dealer to have all the work done. I say this because in the leases I've actually kept for its full term, I had to fill out a questionnaire before the inspection on whether there the car was in an accident. I asked one inspector about that, and he strongly recommended to take any repair to a dealer so that there is no argument between the lessor and lessee as to whether or not the repair was properly completed.

 

[jeffand]

 

[EVA]

Accidents are no fun. The excuse is irrelevant - she rear ended you and is responsible. Your big hope she has a good insurance company. If it is Farmers - I would strongly encourage you to run the repair through your insurance. Farmers will argue with you over where you have the work done and the cost. You will never get away from the argument. If it is State Farm, use an authorized shop and you'll never have to argue about anything.

You are not at fault - your rates will not go up with your insurance company. You will pay your deductible until they settle with her insurance company.

Trust me on having an advocate on your side - you really want that in a big way.

Was she ticketed? Did you file a police report? If you didn't file a report, you have 10 days to file a report at a nearby police station. You should absolutely do that. Things can get very weird very quickly - protect yourself. The police report is simply your description of what happened in front of a police officer. She has an opportunity to file one also.

The reason I say all this - you never know what could happen when she gets home. Don't assume anything.

The advice of going to a Ford dealer is a good one. You could also use your insurance company to recommend somebody. Here's the key thing you need to know about State Farm - when you search for a body shop near you, the list you get is by quality of the shop - NOT location. Just remember that when you look at the list.

Do not accept them to pay you directly for the repair. You will find yourself holding the bag and will have no leverage to get paid.

You want to know what those parts are. Go here to see all the body diagrams of parts for your car. You can figure out what that is from the exploded diagrams. Start at body parts - you should find what you are looking for.

This is the place for national auto parts for Fords (for some reason it starts at Tousley Ford):
http://parts.autonationfordwhitebearlake.com/

Sorry I can't help you with the rear end. If you search this forum, you'll find I have a lot of experience with the front end - my son totaled our first FFE.

 

[hybridbear]

Fantastic pics jeffand!! Thank you so much!

The plastic brace is what shattered on our car, it's completely gone. It looks like just the bumper skin & plastic brace will need to be replaced.

 

[hybridbear]

At about 15 to 20 mph impacts and higher will deploy the air bags. Check the rear hatch for proper fit. The light colored plastic looks like it is part that supports the upper part of the plastic bumper cover. You will need to look at the steel bumper to see if has moved. If the car did hit high on the bumper it may have missed the steel beam crushed the plastic. This leaves the hatch more likely to get hit.

The hatch seems to be ok. There's no visible damage to the hatch & it seems to open fine. The plastic brace is what shattered in the impact. I feel like she hit us going much faster than 15-20 MPH and the airbags didn't go off. We were completely stopped. But since the airbags didn't deploy I guess it's likely that she was going less than 20 MPH.

Doh!!! What a pain. Hope you are okay...

Assuming you have a Ford lease, I'd recommend taking your FFE to a reputable Ford dealer to have all the work done. I say this because in the leases I've actually kept for its full term, I had to fill out a questionnaire before the inspection on whether there the car was in an accident. I asked one inspector about that, and he strongly recommended to take any repair to a dealer so that there is no argument between the lessor and lessee as to whether or not the repair was properly completed.

Thanks for the good advice. This was my thought as well and your comment cements my desire to get it fixed by a Ford dealer. Most local dealers do not do any body work on-site, but from searching websites this morning I think I found one that does. I submitted a request on their website for them to contact me on Monday. After reading EVA's comment I discovered another dealer with a collision center who I'll also contact.

Accidents are no fun. The excuse is irrelevant - she rear ended you and is responsible. Your big hope she has a good insurance company. If it is Farmers - I would strongly encourage you to run the repair through your insurance. Farmers will argue with you over where you have the work done and the cost. You will never get away from the argument. If it is State Farm, use an authorized shop and you'll never have to argue about anything.

You are not at fault - your rates will not go up with your insurance company. You will pay your deductible until they settle with her insurance company.

Trust me on having an advocate on your side - you really want that in a big way.

Was she ticketed? Did you file a police report? If you didn't file a report, you have 10 days to file a report at a nearby police station. You should absolutely do that. Things can get very weird very quickly - protect yourself. The police report is simply your description of what happened in front of a police officer. She has an opportunity to file one also.

The reason I say all this - you never know what could happen when she gets home. Don't assume anything.

The advice of going to a Ford dealer is a good one. You could also use your insurance company to recommend somebody. Here's the key thing you need to know about State Farm - when you search for a body shop near you, the list you get is by quality of the shop - NOT location. Just remember that when you look at the list.

Do not accept them to pay you directly for the repair. You will find yourself holding the bag and will have no leverage to get paid.

You want to know what those parts are. Go here to see all the body diagrams of parts for your car. You can figure out what that is from the exploded diagrams. Start at body parts - you should find what you are looking for.

This is the place for national auto parts for Fords (for some reason it starts at Tousley Ford):
http://parts.autonationfordwhitebearlake.com/

Sorry I can't help you with the rear end. If you search this forum, you'll find I have a lot of experience with the front end - my son totaled our first FFE.

Her insurance is from The Hartford. The police came and filed a report. She did not get a ticket which disappointed me, she should have gotten a ticket. The police officer didn't ask what happened, all she asked is if we were stopped. Both she & I said that we were stopped and the officer said "ok" and wrote up her report. Tomorrow I will go to the police station and get a copy. I'm glad that the accident happened in Edina, the suburb where we live. Our suburb is a very low crime area so the police have nothing to do and thus they'll come to fender benders. In Minneapolis proper the police are so busy with gang activity, drug dealers and homicides that they won't come to an accident scene unless someone needs to be rushed to the hospital in an ambulance. I once was rear-ended while stopped at a red light in Minneapolis and fortunately the young woman who hit me was honest and told her insurance company that it was her fault. She had Progressive and they were very good to work with. The other time I was rear-ended was just a week after I got my license when I was 16 and the police came to that one and gave the other driver two tickets. His insurance was also very good to work with, I believe it was State Farm.

I do not want the insurance to pay us, I will make sure they pay the shop directly.

I don't know how Farmers could argue about where the work is done, in MN there's a law which says that the insurance company cannot try to influence where the claimant has the vehicle repaired as long as they're using an accredited shop. If the insurance company doesn't like the price the shop is charging the insurance company must fight with the body shop to get the body shop to reduce their price.

Our Prius got hit while it was parked on the street by a driver who had State Farm. He also honestly admitted to State Farm that he hit our car while trying to parallel park and State Farm took care of everything. They tried to pay me and have me pay the shop but I wouldn't allow them to do that. I knew that the amount they had determined to pay was about $100 less than what the body shop was charging. When I got my final paperwork from the body shop I saw that they had reduced their price almost all the way down to the price that State Farm was offering to pay.

Our insurance company is Geico. I'd rather not go through our insurance at all for the repair for two reasons:

• our deductible is $1000, I don't want to give up $1000 now even if I'll get it back later on
  we do not pay for rental car coverage since we have two cars but can get by with one, but it's nice to have two cars, if her insurance pays everything then they'll give us a rental

Tousley Ford (now called Autonation Ford White Bear Lake) is about 25 miles from where we live. I see on their website that they have a collision center and they are an EV Certified dealer. I will contact them tomorrow morning.

Thanks everyone for the sympathy & great suggestions!

 

[unplugged]

At about 15 to 20 mph impacts and higher will deploy the air bags.

Airbags do not deploy in a rear collision unless there is some subsequent collision that affects the front or side of the car. There are no airbag sensors in the rear of the car, nor are sensors (and airbags) necessary for a rear collision unless it is extremely violent and results in a rollover or collision with another object. **

On a side note, you have my empathy for your collision. I know how upset I got in the few collisions I have had (and all the result of another driver). And you just got your car so recently. The good news is that you should be able to just get the white plastic brackets replaced. (It looks like they were made for this purpose. They gave up their lives so the metal bumper would not bend.) And the bumper cover replaced and painted like new.

Good Luck!

** As a footnote, front or side collisions which do involve airbag sensors, are not based upon the speed of the collision. These sensors are MEMS acelerometers that move in relation to impact. For instance, if the FFE bottomed out and hit a stationary object in the road, the airbags could deploy even if there was no front-end damage. The rapid deceleration could result in the sensor tripping even without a bumper collision. Similarly, the side curtain airbag deploys when the FFE reaches a certain tilt angle even if there is no collision. These bags do not quickly deflate like the front and knee airbags so as to provide a cushion in the event of a rollover.

 

[EVA]

The best of luck to you Hybridbear. Sounds like you have all the right things going for you.

If the police report looks incomplete to you - I think you can add comments at the police station.

 

[hybridbear]

At about 15 to 20 mph impacts and higher will deploy the air bags.

Airbags do not deploy in a rear collision unless there is some subsequent collision that affects the front or side of the car. There are no airbag sensors in the rear of the car, nor are sensors (and airbags) necessary for a rear collision unless it is extremely violent and results in a rollover or collision with another object. **

On a side note, you have my empathy for your collision. I know how upset I got in the few collisions I have had (and all the result of another driver). And you just got your car so recently. The good news is that you should be able to just get the white plastic brackets replaced. (It looks like they were made for this purpose. They gave up their lives so the metal bumper would not bend.) And the bumper cover replaced and painted like new.

Good Luck!

** As a footnote, front or side collisions which do involve airbag sensors, are not based upon the speed of the collision. These sensors are MEMS acelerometers that move in relation to impact. For instance, if the FFE bottomed out and hit a stationary object in the road, the airbags could deploy even if there was no front-end damage. The rapid deceleration could result in the sensor tripping even without a bumper collision. Similarly, the side curtain airbag deploys when the FFE reaches a certain tilt angle even if there is no collision. These bags do not quickly deflate like the front and knee airbags so as to provide a cushion in the event of a rollover.

Thanks for the excellent airbag information, that's what I thought.

The best of luck to you Hybridbear. Sounds like you have all the right things going for you.

If the police report looks incomplete to you - I think you can add comments at the police station.

Seems like things will go smoothly. Her insurance company, The Hartford, has already started processing the claim. They arranged for a rental from Enterprise which will be dropped off at my office this afternoon. I'm taking the car today to one of their "approved repair shops" for an estimate. I can then take that estimate to AutoNation Ford Collision and as long as they'll do the repair for the same price as the "approved repair shop" then the insurance company will pay them directly. The insurance adjuster also said that if the repair shop we use finds additional damage they will need to contact the adjuster for approval but that it shouldn't be an issue.

One thing I was reading in a handbook published by the State of MN about car insurance claims says that you have the right under MN law to receive a rental vehicle that is "comparable" to your damaged vehicle when you're not at fault and the other insurance is paying. I guess this means that if you have a minivan for example you could request that the insurance provide you with a minivan as the rental. However, this only applies when it's not your insurance paying for the rental. If your insurance is paying then you're bound by the rules you agreed to in your policy. The handbook states that if you have a "high-value" or "specialty" vehicle that you may be required to justify to the insurance company why they should incur the extra expense to provide you with a comparable vehicle. I would've liked to have requested that the insurance arrange for us to have another EV as a rental since we have an EV, but I don't think any of the car rental companies around here have EVs so I didn't bother asking.

 

[unplugged]

...you have the right under MN law to receive a rental vehicle that is "comparable" to your damaged vehicle when you're not at fault and the other insurance is paying. ... I would've liked to have requested that the insurance arrange for us to have another EV as a rental since we have an EV, but I don't think any of the car rental companies around here have EVs so I didn't bother asking.

Ah, but you can request that the insurance company buy your gas since you wouldn't have to buy gas. And you can show them that your electricity use is only so many cents a mile, so you can just have them offset the gas charges by the small amount you pay for electricity. Worth a try....

 

[hybridbear]

...you have the right under MN law to receive a rental vehicle that is "comparable" to your damaged vehicle when you're not at fault and the other insurance is paying. ... I would've liked to have requested that the insurance arrange for us to have another EV as a rental since we have an EV, but I don't think any of the car rental companies around here have EVs so I didn't bother asking.

Ah, but you can request that the insurance company buy your gas since you wouldn't have to buy gas. And you can show them that your electricity use is only so many cents a mile, so you can just have them offset the gas charges by the small amount you pay for electricity. Worth a try....

Yeah, I guess I can ask. Things are moving very slowly. The insurance company approved all the repairs yesterday & parts were ordered then but they won't arrive until Monday or Tuesday. I'm quite disappointed that the parts aren't being overnighted from Ford in Michigan to the repair shop in MN. I'd think the insurance would have preferred to pay for that rather than pay for extra days of rental car...

 

[Abelgoddard]

I'm late to the party on this thread, but I'll start with 'bummer, dude!'

And next, my 2 cents about rear end accidents. I've been in more than my fair share, I believe (never at fault), and been stiffed by a couple of them. The first was when I was 16 and didn't know anything and the guy dealt with my dad but I recall that we got zilch from him.

The other one chaps my hide though. It was about 3 years ago, and the guy was young and nice to talk to and very apologetic and we swapped insurance info. But then it turns out he had a valid insurance card, but had not paid for it since getting the card! I had to get my car fixed to make it useable (trunk lid was jammed closed), so I went through my insurance. They worked with me and brought my deductible down to $400 and promised to reimburse me when they got any money from the guy. He had responded to a couple of my contact attempts but that ended quickly. Never got a dime from him. :evil:

My insurance said what really hampers the situation, as far as getting money from the guy, is that I didn't get a police report. There were no injuries, so 911 said exchange insurance info. Without a police report, it becomes my word against his and there is no leverage they can apply against him to force him to pay. The most they could really do is harass him with letters and phone calls, but he can totally ignore those. If there had been a report, whether he got a ticket or not, he could be threatened with losing his license.

So, my lesson learned is: ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS call the police and get them out there. Claim an injury if you have to, so that they'll come out, but getting that report is VITAL. No matter how nice they are and whether they admit fault to you and seem honest, without the report you could be in for trouble.

 

[hybridbear]

The car is back and repaired. The repair was shockingly cheap! Only about $1200. The steel bumper cost less than $300 and the plastic shock absorber only cost about $25. The bumper cover didn't need to be replaced but was just repaired and repainted. The hatch closes correctly and the cover for the storage area just inside the hatch also now closes correctly. I'm very satisfied with the repair work.

 

[jmueller065]

Great!

 

[hybridbear]

Can't even see what was repaired.

Before:


After: