FFE developing a "charge fault" problem

[WattsUp]

I have owned my FFE for over two years and never had an issue with charging. I do a fair amount of both Level 1 and Level 2 charging at various locations.

Over the last week, my FFE has started having charge fault (seemingly) towards the end of charging (when reaching around 80-90% SOC). A charge fault itself is bad enough, but I also noticed that I don't receive a charge fault notification via MFM on my phone or the website (though I do have the notification enabled). I just "discover" the fault when I arrive at my car to find it not fully charged, or if I happen to check the charging status on my phone.

Anyway, I've seen this behavior mostly while charging at Level 1 using the stock Ford EVSE. The faults have occurred at different locations at work and home. I have even tested charging using another Ford EVSE (borrowed from a fellow FFE owner) and still received a fault. I also had one fault at Level 2 at a public ChargePoint station at the beginning of the week.

In short, I don't think the problem is the EVSEs or the charging locations that I'm using. Unfortunately, I think the problem is in the car.

Has anyone else experienced a similar development with their FFE?

 

[sefs]

OBC is probably going bad. Get it swapped out under warranty.

 

[jeffand]

I would first inspect the charging port on the car for any signs of heating or melting. Next inspect the electrical connection under the hood. The plastic snap connector is infront of 12 volt battery or just to the right, and will have two sets of orange wires passing through it. It will also be helpfull to know what type of charging fault you are seeing?

 

[michael]

This sounds like the symptoms I experienced related to the grid based location. It would simply stop charging without notice. I assume no chance this is involved in your case?

 

[WattsUp]

This sounds like the symptoms I experienced related to the grid based location. It would simply stop charging without notice. I assume no chance this is involved in your case?

With a charge fault?

In this case, the car is trying to charge, but experiencing a fault. Besides, I don't use Value Charge profiles, and every profile I have (a couple for home and four for work, due to the grid problem) is set to Charge Now. And the problem follows me from place to place, even those locations without a saved profile -- and the Default profile is set to Charge Now.

 

[WattsUp]

It will also be helpfull to know what type of charging fault you are seeing?

How would I determine that?

The MFM status just says "charge fault". Is there some way to find out the type?

 

[michael]

This sounds like the symptoms I experienced related to the grid based location. It would simply stop charging without notice. I assume no chance this is involved in your case?

With a charge fault?

In this case, the car is trying to charge, but experiencing a fault. Besides, I don't use Value Charge profiles, and every profile I have (a couple for home and four for work, due to the grid problem) is set to Charge Now. And the problem follows me from place to place, even those locations without a saved profile -- and the Default profile is set to Charge Now.

Yes, that was the symptom. It falsely reported a charge fault. I wouldn't have mentioned it if that weren't the case.

What seemed to happen is that the car would periodically check its location during the course of the charge. If at one point it determined that it was at a ghost location, it would revert to another profile and lose its mind. It would either simply stop charging or report a charge fault.

However, if your default is set to "charge now" this isn't the problem. Setting mine to charge now fixed the problem right away. As I said, I assume no chance this is the case, but I raised it in order to avoid the slim possibility you hadn't considered it.

 

[jeffand]

This could be an issue with the cars GPS not getting a good signal. This canbe caused by parking inside a parking structure, or one that has metal roof. Once i parked in a parking structure and Ford mobile showed the cars location in the middel of lake Michigan.

 

[Rogerschro]

This could be an issue with the cars GPS not getting a good signal. This canbe caused by parking inside a parking structure, or one that has metal roof. Once i parked in a parking structure and Ford mobile showed the cars location in the middel of lake Michigan.

That would explain a charge fault! LOL! submerged can't be good for the electrics! :lol:

 

[WattsUp]

This could be an issue with the cars GPS not getting a good signal.

Unlikely. I have been parking the exactly the same places for the last 2+ years.

 

[WattsUp]

I would first inspect the charging port on the car for any signs of heating or melting. Next inspect the electrical connection under the hood. The plastic snap connector is infront of 12 volt battery or just to the right, and will have two sets of orange wires passing through it.

Inspected the charge port (bright light shown to look deep into the connectors) and orange cabling. Everything looks pristine.

I've also not noticed anything ever getting "too warm" while charging, and I check every now and then.

 

[WattsUp]

Over the last week, my FFE has started having charge fault (seemingly) towards the end of charging (when reaching around 80-90% SOC).

In addition to what I've already described, there is another odd thing that has been happening for the last week or so, that I now realize could be related...

A few times I have started my car to see an unexpectedly low range estimate shown on the GOM... like 20 miles instead of 70, for example. However, the GOM will begin incrementing (without the car actually being driven yet) so that, over the course of the next 30-60 seconds, it is back up to the expected estimate. I just sit there in the garage watching the GOM increase until it is back to where I remember it last was.

Similarly, there has been once or twice, after the car has been parked for a while (say, overnight) I will check the status via the MFM app and happen to catch the range estimate being similarly very low. When I press the update button (which normally takes about 30 seconds or so to update) the estimate will be back to normal. I think this behavior seen through MFM might be a variation of the same behavior I've seen inside the car (e.g., the range estimate somehow "waking up" and returning to normal).

I hadn't seen either of these behaviors until this last week.

Anyone else have this "increasing GOM" thing happen?

 

[WattsUp]

This sounds like the symptoms I experienced related to the grid based location. It would simply stop charging without notice. I assume no chance this is involved in your case?

With a charge fault?

I assume no chance this is the case, but I raised it in order to avoid the slim possibility you hadn't considered it.

Thanks. Yeah, I had considered it... but I double-checked all my profiles (in case they had somehow become set to Value Charge) but that type of thing doesn't seem to be the cause of my problem. All my settings, shown by MFM and the MFT screen inside the car, are as I expect them to be.

 

[WattsUp]

I should also add that I have physically witnessed the car experiencing one of these charge faults.

While in the charge fault state (according to MFM), standing there looking at the car, the charging ring is lit, but there is no pulsating segment. Just three segments (for example) lit up steady (indicating the current SOC). In this state, MFM will report either "charge fault" or "plugged in, waiting to charge". (Btw, I never get a charge fault notification text or email when these faults occur -- I just sometimes see that status when I actively check MFM.)

At some point (and without me doing anything) the car seems to attempt to begin charging again. First, some relays click inside the car and inside the Ford EVSE, and the entire ring goes dark. A second or so later, more relay clicking, and then the ring comes back on. But, instead of settling in and quietly charging as normal... after another second or two, the entire ring flashes quickly on and off several times (which I guess is "ring speak" for "charge fault") and then goes back to just the steady lit segments, with none pulsating, just as before.

Then the car just sits there in that state, and the whole process repeats about five minutes later, as if the car is in some kind of "loop", continuously trying to charge.

When I finally intervene, and unplug and replug the EVSE into the car, charging resumes normally -- to completion in all these cases so far where I have intervened, but I haven't done enough testing to know if that would always be so. (But that doesn't really matter, since there shouldn't have been a charge fault to begin with.)

 

[WattsUp]

instead of settling in and quietly charging as normal... after another second or two, the entire ring flashes quickly on and off several times (which I guess is "ring speak" for "charge fault") and then goes back to just the steady lit segments, with none pulsating, just as before.

Hmm, on page 334 of the 2013 owner's manual, it says this about the ring and a charge fault:

"If a vehicle charging system fault is detected at any point in a charge cycle the entire light ring will flash continuously for one minute and then shut off."

In my case, the ring certainly doesn't flash like this for one whole minute. More like 5 or 10 seconds.

Also, the ring doesn't "shut off" after the flashing stops, it stays lit up, just without the normal pulsating segment. And, as I mentioned, eventually the car tries charging again.

The manual also notes that the Ford EVSE has a charge fault indicator that will light up red if the EVSE itself has detected a fault. This red indicator was not lit in the cases where, according to MFM status, my FFE was experiencing a charge fault (using either my original EVSE or the one I borrowed). In fact, I have never seen the red indicator the entire time I have used the Ford EVSE... just the green one, either steady or flashing.

 

[jmueller065]

Since an EVSE is basically a glorified GFCI I would suspect that the red light on the Ford EVSE is just the ground-fault indicator.

 

[jeffand]

I would take it to the dealership and see if they can read any fault codes.
If this doesn't help in finding the problem. I would disconnect the 12 volt battery for 5 minutes to see if this clears up problem as a last resort.
The charging station sends a signal to the car telling it how much current it can draw. If for some reason the car can't read this signal this could cause a fault. The on board charger is located in the tunnel between the two front seats. This is the most likely causing the charging fault.

 

[michael]

I have seen enough problems generally similar to what you are describing that I think this is a design issue, not a sample fault with your car.

I have seen the charge indicator (on the app and web site) show solid red when there was plenty of charge. Updating cleared the issue.

I understand that Ford modified the website to provide what they call push notifications. I presume this means that they now periodically poll the car to determine its status. If so, this gives the car the opportunity to misjudge its location.

It seems possible that when this happens and the car suddenly finds itself in a different location than it thought, it might briefly interrupt the charging process. Some EVSE units might be designed to see this as a fault condition and shut down. I have seen this happen for no apparent reason, and it required me to stop-and-start charging on the EVSE panel to clear the condition.

When you car is in the trying-to-restart loop, is there any indication on your EVSE that it has faulted out? What brand(s) of EVSE units have you seen this problem with? Can you try to reset the EVSE (rather than unplugging/replugging the car) to see if this clears the issue?



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[WattsUp]

Since an EVSE is basically a glorified GFCI I would suspect that the red light on the Ford EVSE is just the ground-fault indicator.

Sure, but I just meant to clarify that I haven't seen any evidence that the EVSE is contributing to the problem I'm seeing. (And that possibility is even less likely since I switched the EVSE to my friend's identical unit, and still got a fault.)

 

[WattsUp]

I have seen enough problems generally similar to what you are describing that I think this is a design issue ...

Perhaps, but I am still suspecting the car at this point.

I've also seen the types of MFM "buggy behaviors" you describe, but I suspect the "low estimate then normal estimate" issue I've seen is the same thing that I see happen on the dash (and may or may not be related to the new charging problems I've also been having over a similar period of time).

When you car is in the trying-to-restart loop, is there any indication on your EVSE that it has faulted out?

No. As I described earlier, I have never seen any of the EVSEs that I use with my FFE indicating any problem, even now with this new problematic behavior. Just the car is complaining.

What brand(s) of EVSE units have you seen this problem with?

I use the stock Ford unit for Level 1 charging, a ClipperCreek LCS-25 for Level 2 charging, and plenty of public ChargePoint stations.

Can you try to reset the EVSE (rather than unplugging/replugging the car) to see if this clears the issue?

I haven't. I could try that as an experiment (although the manual actually explicitly warns that this should not be done).