Car is bricked!

[TonySpice]

Hi everyone, went in today AM to get in the car but its bricked, cannot even get into it - when I tried to open it using the key fob the indicators flashed a little but car did not open. Tried the other key fob, same result.

Called Ford roadside and all they can do is tow it to the dealer, no other recommendations. Did this happen to anyone else, is there any number you can call for technical support in this sort of issue?

Yesterday was a particularly wet and cold day in NJ but the car was running fine - today its like a massive brick sitting in the middle of the driveway.

Edit: Last week My Ford Mobile also stopped working. Not sure if its related.

 

[davideos]

I think your 12v battery might be dead. Use the physical key in the key fob to unlock The door and pop the hood. Hook up a standard car battery charger to your 12v battery. If you have a volt meter, record the voltage before you start....just for curiosity.

After the car battery charges, the high voltage battery will be able to take over if you drive the car.

The dealer should then check the charging voltages to ensure it doesn't happen again. There have been a number of similar occurances. It seems that some of the 12v batteries have been bad. I've been monitoring my 12v battery for the last week just to see how the car keeps it charged. It seems to be doing it correctly, but I do notice that the voltage is sitting at 12.02v when it hasn't been charged for a few hours. It really should be at 12.6v. I suspect my car to do the same one of these days.

Best of luck. You will be driving around in no time.

 

[Susan]

I had this happen around 2 weeks ago. I drive the car fine the day before and the next day the car was dead. I used the key and realied from reading the forum the 12v battery had died. I called for service and they flat bedded the car to Ford. The tow truck driver jumped the car and left it running. He asked me if I wanted to drive it to the dealer and I refused. Try to refrain from working in the car yoirself. The last thing you need tonbeing accused of touching X or breaking Y and the tables turn. Once you get the new battery you should be fine. They did find error codes post recall upgrade that they resolved. Ask about that

 

[TonySpice]

Thanks guys.

For some reason I just didn't think about the 12v battery.

If this had happened in any gas powered vehicle I would have checked that 999 out of 1000 times!!!!



I'll go and check it now and hopefully I can cancel the Ford tow.

 

[TonySpice]

Unfortunately went out and the car and driveway are covered in 2" of snow (I'm in N.Jersey area) and its still coming down hard.

OK, will wait for this to subside and try later, hopefully before it gets too dark.

 

[TonySpice]

Abandoned the attempt for tonight.

Way to cold, snow still coming down hard in Jersey and light is gone.

Could try again tomorrow AM ...but then I'd still have to wait for it to charge and still have the mystery of why the battery died (I assume an alternator exists in this).

I'm taking Susan's advice and letting Ford tow it.

Let the dealer figure out whats gone wrong (I have the 30 day rental package).

 

[davideos]

No, there is no alternator...well, not what you are thinking of. Honestly, I'm not sure myself, but there is likely a DC to DC converter and a 12V charging circuit. When the car is on, it will send a voltage similar to what an alternator would produce in order to run the accessories, headlights, and charge the battery for the time the car was not on. Reading the Focus manual, you will see that ford recommends disconnecting the 12V battery if storing the car for 30 days or more...which means, there is some current draw when the car is off.

Watching the voltages last week, I can tell that when the 12V battery is charged and there isn't much current draw (i.e. the headlights are off), then the voltage drops down to a trickle charge or a "float" voltage.

Anyway, I can't say if your problem is your battery or your charging circuit, but my guess is it is simply the battery. You will likely want the dealer to replace the battery regardless if it is the battery or not. Damage occurs to the battery when the voltage drops below 10.5V. It is likely that if they charge it back up, it will seem ok, but if it did this once, it is likely to do it again. If you have a volt meter, you can determine this by popping the hood and measuring the battery; however, with 2" of snow on top, I wouldn't want to check either.

One thing to note: The car does charge the 12V battery as it charges your high voltage or drive battery. However, when charging is complete, it no longer charges the 12V battery. That's what I observed. And no, you didn't do anything wrong. The car should be able to keep its 12V battery charged no matter the conditions you drive it in....headlights + stereo + heated seats + cell phone charging in the accessory plug. If your battery dies, it is likely a bad battery...unless you use accessory power for an extended amount of time.

Anyway, it will be good for the dealer to look at it to make sure the charge circuit is working. My prediction is that you will get a new battery.

 

[EVA]

TonySpice - there could be a lot of things wrong. The only place that can fix the problem is your dealer. What happened to you is exactly what happens when the 12V battery dies - you can't open the car, no lights come on, and they might flicker. Yes I had that happen to my car. There are a few threads about the 12V battery.

The key things you want to know:
Suggest to your dealer: apply the programming change described in the technical service bulletin 13-9-19. This is different and in addition to the SSN recall you should have received. Sorry - that reprogramming is not included in the recall, you have to have both done.

The other thing - once you are positive the car is fixed, ask the dealer to replace your 12V battery. From this forum I found out that once a lead acid battery has gone to 2 or 3 volts, the battery is damaged badly (specifically the plates sulfate and the battery loses capacity in a huge way). You'll have to ask this very nicely, and the dealer kind of have to do a little cutting corners to get you a new battery. They should be able to replace it under warranty.

Good luck. Remember - tow the car on a flat bed, not with the rear wheels on the ground. And if Ford Roadside Assistance gets your car started with a jump - your car will stay running and you can drive it to the dealer. I had the towing company follow me to be sure the car didn't die. I happened to know the tow truck driver though.

 

[sourcejockey]

This happened to me the day I bought the damn thing--turned out to be a short in the GPS unit.

 

[JTCalif]

TonySpice - [...]
Suggest to your dealer: apply the programming change described in the technical service bulletin 13-9-19. This is different and in addition to the SSN recall you should have received. Sorry - that reprogramming is not included in the recall, you have to have both done.

As I read it now,
TSB 13-9-19 (Sept. '13) says (after some testing) "Reprogram the [...] (PCM)", unless there are no Diagnostic Test Codes indicated.
SSN recall notice 13S09 (Nov. '13) says largely "dealer to reprogram the [...] (PCM) free of charge".

Is there a relevant different I do not see here?

I have set those both aside, did neither, since my FFE (built in May 2012) simply works; the 12 V. battery has lasted OK, including in 2 weeks when I was on a trip (car unplugged).
"If it ain't broke, don't fix it."
Is there some other gain I am missing out on, not SSN-related?
(Yes, there are imperfections, like dashboard problems, but no big deal.)

 

[TonySpice]

Sorry for the late update.

Took FFE into dealer on Monday.

They agreed battery was flat, but it tested good. They could not find why it had not charged.



Only option for me is to get one of those emergency jump starters ... anyone know if these will be sufficient to get the FFE started?

 

[mlct88]

My FFE was totally dead this morning. Didn't drive it yesterday....not sure if there is a connection there. My Ford Mobile also stopped working 2 weeks ago...not sure if that's connected either. Had it towed to dealer via flatbed (1st tow company tried to talk me into normal towing), Will update the results when I hear from dealer.

Here's an update: Got the car back yesterday after dealer replaced 12 volt battery.

In addition to the mobile ap not working in the last 2 weeks , the car would not go into Value Mode for charging.

I had asked them to look at Technical Bulletin 13-09-19 because there were numerous comments about this in other reports on this blog. They performed the TSB and re-flashed the PCM.

So, as of today, everything is back to normal. Ap is working too.

 

[davideos]

13S09 is the one that will fix the issue for when the car simply decides to stop...anytime anywhere (SSN). I would suggest you get that one done. Since this was release, no one has experienced the problem. There are some other recalls, but this one is the biggest saftey concern. I had my FFE for 10mo and about 9k miles before it happend, the SSN. It is different for everyone.

 

[EVA]

JT - thank you for finding that Technical Service Bulletin. I am so sorry I didn't get TonySpice that number.

"TSB 13-9-19 (Sept. '13) says (after some testing) "Reprogram the [...] (PCM)", unless there are no Diagnostic Test Codes indicated."

Tony and Mlct88 - You need to tell your dealer to read that TSB and apply the fix. Tony if the problem happens again, point them at that bulletin. They won't figure it out on their own. My car had to be towed to the dealer twice for a dead 12V battery. Dead because I left it plugged in for 2 days and didn't drive it. After that TSB programming was applied, the car never did it again.

Not to jump to conclusions - there could be something else wrong with your car. What you described sounds a lot like what I experienced with my car.

Mlct88 - be sure to call your dealer on Monday and mention that TSB.

Davideos, the safety recall you quote does not apply that 13-9-19 TSP reprogramming.

Oh Tony - yes one of the portable packs will restart your car. Just leave it in place for about a minute before you try to start it. The car will likely click and blink and make a ton of noises as the battery in the car comes up to power.

 

[TonySpice]

Thanks everyone on the additional feedback.

I will take that info back to Ford for discussion.

 

[Nal67]

I went out yesterday evening to a dead car. It had been plugged in for two days and was fully charged at that time. I assume it is the 12V battery so having it towed to the dealer. This is just the latest of my ongoing issues with the car so can't same I'm surprised. Love my car when it works but it has been in the shop for more than a month and issues since January 2013, mostly with charging (or failure to...). Trying for a dealer buy-back.

I do have all the current updates and recalls and no text messages received about a low battery.

 

[Photomutt]

I had my 2013 FFE flat-bed towed and 12V battery replaced in February because it had discharged mysteriously beyond recharge capability. I thought the problem had gone away but last week it happened again. Flat-bed towed (roadside assistance) again and the dealer had the car for four days and couldn't reproduce the problem. I got the car back this Monday because they said the car was working fine. Thursday afternoon the car was fine when I moved it but 24 hours later it was completely dead. I tested the 12V at under 4.5V. It's going into the shop tomorrow for the fourth time in 13 months.

Does anyone know WHY the 12V battery is discharging or WHY the dealer can't reproduce the problem?

I posted a video of the battery testing bad.
http://youtu.be/NQdO9Q9K4Zw?list=PLdwBoVvVN8WWA7uUy__t2vlOoMGBPpQpy

 

[jstack6]

my FFE was dead the day after my last service update. The 12 v was low at 7 volts. I jumped it with a lithium I have and drove to the dealer.

They had not rebooted the CPU after an update so it drained the 12 volt. After tsting and charging it I have not had any more problems.

So one little old fashioned lead acid battery can make the entire 23 kWh traction batter and car not move. The DC to DC to keep the battery did not cut it.

 

[hybridbear]

my FFE was dead the day after my last service update. The 12 v was low at 7 volts. I jumped it with a lithium I have and drove to the dealer.

They had not rebooted the CPU after an update so it drained the 12 volt. After tsting and charging it I have not had any more problems.

So one little old fashioned lead acid battery can make the entire 23 kWh traction batter and car not move. The DC to DC to keep the battery did not cut it.

The DCDC converter only is active if the car is in "Ready to drive" mode. The 12V is also charged when the car is plugged in to your EVSE but once the car determines that the 12V is charged it stops sending power to it and will let it become discharged if the car sits plugged in for many days/weeks.

 

[jeffand]

I think leaving the FFE on a level 2 charger will not run the battery down. I had my FFE plugged in at the airport from monday to friday on a Charge Point public charging station. When I returned to the vehicle I found no problems.