FFE in Winter Ontario

[modeler]

With $14k rebate, I decided to get FFE, picked up the car yesterday, awesome car!!

question: does it really gonna work during Jan and Feb Toronto winter snow season?

I need to make decision whether I should get winter tire for it, as I need to know in real life how wind shield de-iced and de-frost.
I don't have workplace plug, so will NOT be able to pre-condition the car before I leave; but I have relative short range of commute, need no worry for range.
If the car can really heat up the window and blow snow off, I will make it full year car.

Couple of review points:
The speedometer tick is really similar, and number is too big, I cant really tell the exact speed I am at.
Too many button on steering wheel and too busy on dash display.
Otherwise it is awesome car.

 

[user 5595]

I'm not sure what you're saying about the speedometer, but you will get used to the buttons on the steering wheel. The buttons are logically laid out, and the ones "under" the wheel are shaped so you can almost think of them as just one big button.

I would love to see an exhaustive review of all-season and winter tires, and how they perform for noise and economy on an EV. Last year I bought some all-weather Optimo 4s for my Civic. They seemed to do very well in Vancouver's winter, but I don't know whether they'd be a good choice for my FFE.

 

[jmueller065]

With $14k rebate, I decided to get FFE, picked up the car yesterday, awesome car!!

question: does it really gonna work during Jan and Feb Toronto winter snow season?

I need to make decision whether I should get winter tire for it, as I need to know in real life how wind shield de-iced and de-frost.
I don't have workplace plug, so will NOT be able to pre-condition the car before I leave; but I have relative short range of commute, need no worry for range.
If the car can really heat up the window and blow snow off, I will make it full year car.

Couple of review points:
The speedometer tick is really similar, and number is too big, I cant really tell the exact speed I am at.
Too many button on steering wheel and too busy on dash display.
Otherwise it is awesome car.

In 3 years with my FFE I didn't have that much of an issue with Detroit's winters. Use pre-conditioning and the car will be nice and warm in the morning (and if its parked outside the snow will be all melted off of the windows).

How short range is your commute? You may find in winter even with a short commute and no workplace charging that you'll be taking steps to conserve electricity.

 

[modeler]

With $14k rebate, I decided to get FFE, picked up the car yesterday, awesome car!!

question: does it really gonna work during Jan and Feb Toronto winter snow season?

I need to make decision whether I should get winter tire for it, as I need to know in real life how wind shield de-iced and de-frost.
I don't have workplace plug, so will NOT be able to pre-condition the car before I leave; but I have relative short range of commute, need no worry for range.
If the car can really heat up the window and blow snow off, I will make it full year car.

Couple of review points:
The speedometer tick is really similar, and number is too big, I cant really tell the exact speed I am at.
Too many button on steering wheel and too busy on dash display.
Otherwise it is awesome car.

In 3 years with my FFE I didn't have that much of an issue with Detroit's winters. Use pre-conditioning and the car will be nice and warm in the morning (and if its parked outside the snow will be all melted off of the windows).

How short range is your commute? You may find in winter even with a short commute and no workplace charging that you'll be taking steps to conserve electricity.

28km one way, 60km round trip, Do i need conserve?
the heater is 5 kw, car has 170km range over 33 kwh battery, so each kwh can drive 5km.
Each hour on heater is 5kwh, will lose 25km, so say two hour round trip in worst weatherm will eat 50km off the range.
I still be able to get a round trip with 60km extra, correct?
I know it is all theoretical, but reality wasn't all that bad.

 

[modeler]

I'm not sure what you're saying about the speedometer, but you will get used to the buttons on the steering wheel. The buttons are logically laid out, and the ones "under" the wheel are shaped so you can almost think of them as just one big button.

I would love to see an exhaustive review of all-season and winter tires, and how they perform for noise and economy on an EV. Last year I bought some all-weather Optimo 4s for my Civic. They seemed to do very well in Vancouver's winter, but I don't know whether they'd be a good choice for my FFE.

Thanks for reply, is there a true winter in Vancouver, LOL? I guess winter there means 6 hour day light, not means -20 c and foot deep snow.
But thanks

 

[jmueller065]

28km one way, 60km round trip, Do i need conserve?
the heater is 5 kw, car has 170km range over 33 kwh battery, so each kwh can drive 5km.
Each hour on heater is 5kwh, will lose 25km, so say two hour round trip in worst weatherm will eat 50km off the range.
I still be able to get a round trip with 60km extra, correct?
I know it is all theoretical, but reality wasn't all that bad.

Ah yeah bigger battery--you won't have any problems, even running heat.

 

[modeler]

I'm not sure what you're saying about the speedometer, but you will get used to the buttons on the steering wheel. The buttons are logically laid out, and the ones "under" the wheel are shaped so you can almost think of them as just one big button.

I would love to see an exhaustive review of all-season and winter tires, and how they perform for noise and economy on an EV. Last year I bought some all-weather Optimo 4s for my Civic. They seemed to do very well in Vancouver's winter, but I don't know whether they'd be a good choice for my FFE.

I definite will fork out $1k for winter tire if I do want to drive in winter.
The tire is quite lack of grip given the weight, the torque of the car and it could even spin with regen brake on ice road.
So I want to know if it worth to drive in winter at all with wind shield frosted and cold in cabin, if not pre-conditioned in outside.

 

[modeler]

28km one way, 60km round trip, Do i need conserve?
the heater is 5 kw, car has 170km range over 33 kwh battery, so each kwh can drive 5km.
Each hour on heater is 5kwh, will lose 25km, so say two hour round trip in worst weatherm will eat 50km off the range.
I still be able to get a round trip with 60km extra, correct?
I know it is all theoretical, but reality wasn't all that bad.

Ah yeah bigger battery--you won't have any problems, even running heat.

em, ok. as I said, second day in the car; any input is appreciated.

 

[Jimbo]

I live in London ON just down the 401 and I've had no problems with heat or defrost in the winter. I charge at work but not at home so I leave home cold. The heater starts blowing warm in about 1 block from home or if I wait will be melting the ice on the windshield in less than a minute.
As far as the tires are concerned once you get used to the traction the car has in wet weather then you will understand some of the limitations that you may encounter in snow. The traction control will limit the wheel spin but it also severely limits the acceleration away from corners but you will get used to it eventually.
The only good point is the weight balance is very good for the brakes even on slippery roads. Keeping the tires up to the recommended pressure or even a bit more helps with the traction also.

 

[EVA]

Congratulations on buying the car. That's great you are happy.

Think I'm going on 4 winters in Chicago. Never needed winter tires. The original equipment worked just fine.

As I recall from all my travels to Toronto, your winters are very similar to Chicago - about the same amount of snow. You don't get nearly as much snow as Detroit. So you have votes from Detroit and Chicago - no need to mess with winter tires.

You'll figure out how to make the range work. If you find yourself wondering how, read JMueller's excellent blog, the early posts. He describes how to eek out the most range with the car. As he said, you will probably be perfectly fine.

 

[triangles]

I've had mine for the past 3 winters in Northern Ohio. The past 3 winters have been mild so I haven't gotten a whole lot of snow/ice experience in the FFE. As far as winter tires go, I think they are a waste of money at least for Toledo, OH. The stock tires on my previous vehicle have a 185 tread width compared to the wider 235 tread width of the FFE tire. 4 and 5 winters ago were especially snowy and icy and the all season tires I had handled the snow better than expected. I never got stuck and the few times I almost did were because the snow was so deep it was lifting the car off the road. I'd expect the wider FFE tires to handle the deep stuff more poorly. Unfortunately the most they've seen is 4 inches and that was no problem so I don't know yet. I have no doubt snow tires would be an improvement but for as quickly as they clear the roads here it really wouldn't be worth it to get snow tires. I guess what I'm getting it is there's nothing special about the FFE that would require snow tires compared to any other FWD car. If you needed them for your other car then you will probably want them for the FFE.

Not that you need to conserve battery but thanks to jumeller065 I learned that cracking the driver or passenger window significantly reduces window fogging and reduces the amount of defrost you have to use which effectively runs the heater and AC simultaneously to dry the air.

 

[Pearl]

I guess what I'm getting it is there's nothing special about the FFE that would require snow tires compared to any other FWD car.

I would say the stock Michelin Energy tires are nowhere near the tread and handling that a typical car's All Season Radial Tire is capable of.
The winter was also mild in Cleveland, but when the snow machine began dropping 6+ inches, my Blizzaks were certainly worth it.

 

[triangles]

I would say the stock Michelin Energy tires are nowhere near the tread and handling that a typical car's All Season Radial Tire is capable of.

Excluding deep snow since I haven't had any experience with the OE Michelin tires in that yet, I respectfully disagree. Of the all season tires I've had on my other cars, the OE Michelins are average to slightly above average compared to the others. On other cars I've had all season tires that are much better and some that are much worse in snow and ice. It certainly is easier to spin the front wheels on the FFE as they only carry 49% of the vehicle weight compared to a more typical 60+% (ICE FWD) and the electric motor's natural full torque at 0 RPM.

 

[Pearl]

Excluding deep snow since I haven't had any experience with the OE Michelin tires in that yet, I respectfully disagree.

I was speaking of exclusively handling in snow.
Two words, Lake Effect.
Drive just two hours east, triangles and try it!

 

[jmueller065]

Lake Effect: No car does that well when the snow is 10' deep

I used to have endless fun in my F-350 on "snow days".

 

[triangles]

I was speaking of exclusively handling in snow.
Two words, Lake Effect.
Drive just two hours east, triangles and try it!

Okay well I'll take your word for it then since I haven't driven my FFE in deep snow yet. I imagine the width of the tires being bad for snow. Believe me I'm all too familiar with lake effect snow. I used to live in Brunswick and have family all over the Cleveburg area. Sadly for me now by the time the lake effect snow from Lake Michigan gets to Toledo it's a half inch or less. Sometimes even just flurries.

 

[Pearl]

Believe me I'm all too familiar with lake effect snow. I used to live in Brunswick and have family all over the Cleveburg area.

That WEST SIDE snow isn't snow, LOL. The Snow Belt is where it's at !

 

[triangles]

I had always considered Brunswick south side but now that you mention it, it is slightly west and you're right it's not in the primary snow belt but still is in the secondary snow belt. My relatives in Lake County are what I was referring to. They get the awesome snow you speak of. Maybe I should have been more specific instead of saying Cleveburg area.