Stop Safely Now Warning

[triangles]

If you have the climate control on when the car is started and then turn it off the "+12 +13" is normal. The minus single digits is also normal unless you are driving in super zen mode....

 

[signal twenty]

If you have the climate control on when the car is started and then turn it off the "+12 +13" is normal. The minus single digits is also normal unless you are driving in super zen mode....

When I picked the car up last week from the dealership, the A/C was on - I turned it off and that's when I was getting the +12/13, so that makes sense. I am almost always driving in super zen mode so the negatives are a little concerning to me.

 

[triangles]

Signal twenty Configure your left screen to show your trip meter plus the kWh used plus your rolling Wh/mi average. If you reset trip meter (kWh used) when you charge you will be able to see how far you went using how many kWh from the battery. The rolling average Wh/mi is what you should care about being your first clue something is wrong. If you're driving very zen like your Wh/mi should be in the low 200s and if you're really good upper 100s. My summer averages between 225 and 250 Wh/mi and in winter when it gets cold it shoots into the 350+ neighborhood. Seeing as how you're in FL you shouldn't have to worry much about the cold. Also those +/- numbers are based on the guess-o-meter which can fluctuate wildly seemingly without reason. I personally don't pay any attention to it until the battery is below 50% charge. As you get closer to a dead battery the guess-o-meter gets more accurate. Depending on how well the PO treated the battery, you should have between 15-18kWh useable battery capacity. The more often you deep discharge the battery the greater your capacity degradation will be. Also while not as detrimental to battery health, lithium batteries do not like sitting around fully charged all the time. My driving habits result in my battery rarely being discharged much below 30%. Also while I don't have TOU electric rates I use value charging so that my car finishes charging just before I get up in the morning to minimize how long it sits fully charged. The value charging setup is not very intuitive. You have to set 120V or 240V and if the estimated charge time is greater than the time window you specified it will default to charge now.

 

[barrey]

Resurrecting this thread to report a new Stop Safely Now.

2016 FFE, almost 20K miles, wife got the SSN message today for the first time before backing out of the driveway.

Tried a few things and waited a couple hours, but no joy.
While waiting for the tow truck, I hooked up the ELM327 and ForScan and pulled Code P0A0a - High Voltage System Inter-lock Circuit.
- General Electrical Failure.

We'll see what they find...

-Barrey

 

[triangles]

Fingers crossed for a new 33.5kWh battery....

 

[andymcafee]

Asking for advice:

Please forgive me if I am posting this in the wrong thread, but I am currently considering purchasing a specific used FFE. I do not currently own one (only test driven one). The FFE I am considering is 2013 51,500 miles 3 previous owners (according to dealer), VIN: 1FADP3R40DL165335. Otherwise, I don't know much about it. Dealer knows nothing about it. I live in Central TX (50 miles from North Austin). There are a couple of Ford dealers in my town, but they likely have never had a FFE in their service department. I test drove another FFE in Austin, but decided not to buy it as I had a bad feeling about it after I had it inspected and after discovering it was purchased from Auction.

I am basically asking for advice. I have no way of knowing if this FFE has issues. I read this entire thread about the various SSN issues and the headaches it has caused owners. I certainly don't want a high maintenance vehicle. Rather, my objective is to both save money with gas and save time with maintenance (oil, fluids, etc). This vehicle is significantly less expensive than the few 2015 LEAFs I am considering. I really like the FFE, but I would love to hear feedback from other owners before I decide whether or not to drive 125 miles to check it out this weekend.

Any feedback is appreciated!

 

[thanhdaica1985]

Asking for advice:

Please forgive me if I am posting this in the wrong thread, but I am currently considering purchasing a specific used FFE. I do not currently own one (only test driven one). The FFE I am considering is 2013 51,500 miles 3 previous owners (according to dealer), VIN: 1FADP3R40DL165335. Otherwise, I don't know much about it. Dealer knows nothing about it. I live in Central TX (50 miles from North Austin). There are a couple of Ford dealers in my town, but they likely have never had a FFE in their service department. I test drove another FFE in Austin, but decided not to buy it as I had a bad feeling about it after I had it inspected and after discovering it was purchased from Auction.

I am basically asking for advice. I have no way of knowing if this FFE has issues. I read this entire thread about the various SSN issues and the headaches it has caused owners. I certainly don't want a high maintenance vehicle. Rather, my objective is to both save money with gas and save time with maintenance (oil, fluids, etc). This vehicle is significantly less expensive than the few 2015 LEAFs I am considering. I really like the FFE, but I would love to hear feedback from other owners before I decide whether or not to drive 125 miles to check it out this weekend.

Any feedback is appreciated!

You should try to invest in an OBD2 reader that works with ForScan to see what the estimated capacity left for the battery. I bought mine used as well at 71,000. It is now 81,000 with about 15 Kwh left of the original 19.5 usable Kwh. FFE liquid cool is not that smart as the Chevy Bolt since it will only cool if the car is on or plugged in. I haven't had any issue with the car mechanically, other than a failed 12V battery 6 months after my purchase. The range in the winter for me is about 45 miles and now it's about 55 miles with mostly local roads. There's a current recall for the charging cord, make sure the dealer completed that before you buy. Also make sure that they have 2 keys since the key for Focus Electric is very expensive!

 

[JTCalif]

That advice about getting [or borrowing] an OBD2 reader to test the battery is good.
I have a 2015 FFE, after driving a 2012 one for 3 years. Have liked both. Biggest problem: 12 volt battery died after about 3 and 1/2 years, and was glad I could "jump" it then. (Can use metal key inside fob to unlock door, then pop the hood.) Just in case of a repeat someday, I now carry a small Li-ion jumper battery (Boltpower model D29), used just once to jump a friend's ICE Honda.

I estimated my car's battery capacity at around 18 kWh, after 30,000 miles (tested at 52 degree F).
I try to keep it roughly near mid-full (say, between 1/4 and 3/4 capacity), especially when parked a long time: that probably helps its life.
Note that high speed driving (or much use of cabin air heater) cuts expected miles range a Lot. Keeping speed under about 64 mph helps.
Starting: just don't hurry the process (brake pedal, 1 second pause, press Go button, wait a sec. for green light, then drive).

 

[andymcafee]

Thanks for the advice about the ODB2 scanner and making sure 2 keys. Just ordered an ODB2 scanner. A friend of mine has 2014 FFE (owned for about 14 months), which is why I am considering getting one. He loves his, and he had to replace his 12V battery as well. I was primarily concerned with the SSN messages and wondering if I should expect issues with that, but maybe there is not a way to diagnose. Anything else I should look out for?

 

[JTCalif]

Ask about outstanding "Field Service Action" items (mfr. recalls).
With the VIN you posted, can go to owner.ford.com and find something.
Think I saw "12M02" but do not know what that is about.

 

[andymcafee]

I do see 1 recall Last updated 03/29/2019
FSA Title: SYNC WITH MYFORD MYLINCOLN TOUCH WARRANTY EXTENSION COVERING ACCESSORY PROTOCOL INTERFACE MODULE APIM
Field Service Action Number: 12M02

I do have question about battery. Is there any warranty on battery that would still be in effect for this 2013 51000 mile FFE?

 

[thanhdaica1985]

I do see 1 recall Last updated 03/29/2019
FSA Title: SYNC WITH MYFORD MYLINCOLN TOUCH WARRANTY EXTENSION COVERING ACCESSORY PROTOCOL INTERFACE MODULE APIM
Field Service Action Number: 12M02

I do have question about battery. Is there any warranty on battery that would still be in effect for this 2013 51000 mile FFE?

Battery has an 8 years/100,000 miles warranty but no degradation warranty. They only replace if the battery is toast. I see a lot of people who got coolant leaked into battery got their free replacement. And the replacement is also a free upgrade to higher capacity battery. I did get one SSN came up for parking the car outside under very hot condition but I think it was because of the bad 12V battery. A simply trick of turning it off and open the door, then close door, and turn it on again solved the issue and it hasn't come back since. We'll see how hot this summer is. I would probably leave the car on with climate and headlights turned off this summer when it gets really hot. My commute is only 25 miles both ways so I think I can afford using the battery to condition itself because I can't plug it in at work.

 

[triangles]

12M02 is just that they extended the warranty on the APIM. That is the screen/computer than runs MFT. IIRC it was only covered by the 3 year B2B warranty and I believe they extended it to 5 years, but don't quote me on that last part.

 

[shniestEV]

Hi All,
Well my time has come to join the ranks of the extremely frustrated FFE owners. To start i have loved my FFE since the day i bought it and 3 years later it has been one of the best decisions I had made. I now ask for any assistance or guidance on how to move forward.

My 3yr warranty ran out at the end of November 2018. 3 weeks later I got my first real SSN error. It was during christmas break and I shrugged it off as the first time in 3 years I guess it was bound to happen sometime. Following normal procedures i was able to get it going and move on my way.

2 weeks later it happened again. Thought to my self thats odd maybe something is wrong since now thats twice in 2 weeks... then it happened the very next day and two days in a row! Decided I should call dealer and chat.

Dealer charged me $100 found nothing by the time i dropped car off the error code was gone. After the service i drove for a month with no issues so i thought ok maybe a glitch. 2 weeks later it happened again. then it happened the next day... then it happened twice in one day!

Called dealership again.

Long story short.. it kept happenening... more frequently and i finally got it to happen so they could get some kind of code off it (i dont have my own).

Needless to say... passed warranty... they want to charge me $900 for diagnosing my car all this time.... said the error code indicates wiring harness. Wiring harness cost is $1700 plus installation so total bill will be almost $3000.

I asked if they did any of the standard troubleshooting like inspect all the connections etc before reuling that the ENTIRE cable is bad. Considering the vehicle can work fine for a month with no issues.

Told them to give me my car back and I'm not paying anything. I don't even trust driving the car anymore. as who knows where, when and how often its going to pop up.

I've only had my car back for 2 days and so far nothing but that doesn't mean anything since they didn't actually fix anything its a matter of time.

However i ask the forum for help with has anyone had something similar? Did their error code cay it was wiring related? I don't get how the ENTIRE wiring needs to be replaced seems crazy. And lastly the only thing i can think of is in december i installed a new dash cam and literally plugged into USB port nothing more. This is the only change that happened around the november/december time line. I also noticed that come january the dash cam was never really charging properly. It would however work. During this period i had my mechanic friend test the battery with load and he mentioned that if it was a gas focus and I brought it to him he would suggest i replace the 12v battery but doesn't know if thats my SSN issue.

But thinking that my dashcam had issues getting power to run and charge its inetrnal battery maybe i do have a 12v battery issue and could that be the cause of an SSN error? I'm thinking of not paying any money to get my car fixed as per the dealers diagnostics and just trying a new 12v battery. I have since removed the dash cam altogether in case it to also caused some kind of system fault in the wiring.

Let me know as i really love this car but at the point i don't trust driving it and letting my wife drive it knowing that at any inconvenient moment the SSN will appear and make you block traffic. Would you trade it in for something else? Leaf? Bolt? Model 3? Soul? Do you fix it and trust that it will never happen again? lol i dont...

Thanks.

PS: I've currently had 10 SSN warnings since december 26th until May 16th. That's averaging 2 a month. Sigh...

 

[Dobrinia]

You need elm327 and forscan ( https://forscan.org/download.html ) to read errors and parameters, do you have it?
You can read the error yourself and find the cause of the damage.

 

[mdfocus]

Call dealer back. Have them check 8 year 100k mile coverage on electric power train.

 

[shniestEV]

They told me it wasnt and the warranty guide doesn't list it

"The following plug-in-vehicle unique parts (if equipped) are covered
during this extended coverage period: high-voltage battery packs,
high-voltage charger, DC/DC convertor, electronic drive module
assembly (includes electric motor and gearbox), transmission range
sensor, and charge cord.
Note: Lithium-Ion Battery Gradual Capacity Loss
The Lithium-ion battery (EV battery) will experience gradual
capacity loss with time and use (similar to all lithium-ion batteries),
which is considered normal wear and tear. Loss of battery capacity
due to or resulting from gradual capacity loss is NOT covered under
the New Vehicle Limited Warranty. See your Owner’s Manual for
important tips on how to maximize the life and capacity of the
Lithium-ion battery."

 

[shniestEV]

You need elm327 and forscan ( https://forscan.org/download.html ) to read errors and parameters, do you have it?
You can read the error yourself and find the cause of the damage.

No I don't. Where is the best place to get it?

 

[Dobrinia]

Buy in the nearest store in your city. Google "elm327"

 

[davideos]

Here's some comments from my experience. The SSN issues doesn't necessarily mean it is a EV related (8yr 100k) problem. I had an SSN issue a year and a half ago where my battery was replaced. However, the week before that diagnosis was made, the dealer diagnosed a relay that was not covered under the warranty. Cost me $100 for the $25 part and $75 for the labor. However, I don't believe for a minute that this was the real issue...but I think that was the best diagnosis they were able to make. This was before I got my OBDII Bluetooth module and Forscan running. No hard feelings...I give the dealer the benefit of the doubt. However, it does reinforce something that I have come to know...there are likely 100s of possible issues that lead to the same symptom...SSN. This is why I purchased the Forscan setup; so I don't have to rely on the dealer to tell me what's wrong.

In this case, I'd try a different dealer. When I had my issues, they didn't charge me to diagnose. Their position was that they would do the diagnosis and then seek payment from me or from Ford depending on the outcome. Sure, you have to trust they do the right thing, but I've been doing pretty good by my dealer...even with the $100 I paid for what I thought was an incorrect diagnosis. But, I think my dealer is much better than the one who wants to be paid for the diagnosis. Could be they don't know how to effectively diagnose the car and want to be paid for their time in case they are not efficient. If possible, find a dealer others have used for EV troubles. I do agree that Forescan is a good first step; but it isn't always a slam dunk.

Here are my Forscan experiences.
1) After I had the battery swap, the car was getting charging faults. Took me 2 days to notice that the temp of the on-board charger was getting too hot...using Forscan. Oringinally I was monitoring the charging current and noticing that it was starting out with a high current but eventually throttling back...eventually down to 1 to 2 AMPs before stopping and issuing a charge fault. I also noticed a funny sound which turned out to be one of the cooling pumps running dry. Eventually I noticed the high temp of the charger using Forescan and then noticed the coolant was very low. Dealer forgot to put coolant back in after swapping the battery. The charge circuit is in the same coolant loop. No cost to me; dealer fixed.

2) After about 1 year after the battery swap, I got SSN again. Got it quite a few times. Using Forscan I could see a communication fault between the TCU and the battery. There was another issue logged, but I don't remember what it was. After taking it to the dealer, they double checked the TSBs and sent me on my way. I got an SSN 2 times on the way home but I was able to get it home. Called the dealer and dropped it off the next day. Got a call mid day that it was ready. They went from connector to connector looking for an issue and found that the main battery connector at the rear passengerside wheel was not fully seated....likely another issue from the battery swap a year earlier. Forscan wasn't too helpful to me at the time, but in retrospect it made sense. No cost to me.

3) I got a yellow wrench thrown. I had this issue off and on well after the 3 year 30k warranty with respect to the cruise control. Cruise control would work, but if I tried to press the "resume" after disengaging with the brake or "cancel", I'd get a yellow wrench. I read the codes with Forscan and it indicated an issue with the steering wheel module. After a wrench was thrown a subsequent time, I noticed that the cruise control wasn't working at all. Later, with no yellow wrench, I noticed that the cruise control wasn't working at all. The error code, when searched online, indicated some issue with other steering wheel controls. Long story short, I suspected that the switch contacts were likely not conducting very well due to lack of use. I ended up just working the switches a bit aggressively and the problem went away. No more yellow wrenches and the Forscan errors are no longer generated....and cruise control is working. There is a good chance it is a coincidence, but at least I do see correlation with Forscan and its ability to help diagnose.

Anyway, for this case, find another dealer