Stop Safely Now Warning

[v_traveller]

My turn!

I guess it was a matter of time, since I never did get that software update. Two years and 26,250 miles have flown by, apparently my luck has run out.

Got the SSN this morning on the way to work, stop-and-go traffic in the HOV lane. Here's the sequence of events:

1. Coasting at about 10mph, SSN appears.
2. I said the f-word. SSN persists.
3. Traffic speeds up. I accelerate. SSN still showing. So I keep driving.
4. About 15-20 seconds later, traffic is at a standstill. I stop.
5. Traffic moves. I try to move. No dice. I am stuck.
6. Shifted to Park. Powered off, then powered on. No green car light. Yellow wrench appears. Tried again. Still no green car light. I turn on my hazards.
7. White F-Series work truck behind me crosses the double yellow on the right to get around me.
8. Shifted to N, opened the door. Pushed my FFE toward the Jersey wall on the left, into the breakdown lane.
9. Must have been on a downhill, FFE started picking up speed. Jumped into the driver's seat to regain control. Closed the door, coasted to a stop. Parked about six inches from the Jersey wall. Shut off.
10. Opened and closed the door. Tried to start. No dice. Tried again. Still no dice.
11. Locked the doors using the key fob. Unlocked. Opened and closed the door. Pressed the start button. Success!
12. Buckled in. Traffic moving at about 10mph. Merged back into the HOV lane in front of a black Mercedes (ICE) with a single driver (*******!).

No SSN for the rest of the day. Clocked about 70 miles since it appeared. Interestingly, it now feels sluggish when I stomp on it from a constant cruising speed between 30mph and 50mph.... for those of you with a Volt, my FFE now has that same anemic reaction to flooring it that the Volt has when in "Normal" mode. Seems to have lost its spunk.

So... I guess it's time to visit the dealer to take care of the recalls; will keep y'all posted. Thanks to all that shared how they "rebooted" after their SSN... your advice came in handy!

 

[ergagn]

Hi. I own my FFE 2012 since two years now and there is 55000km on the odo. I am quite satisfied with this car up to now and the only bad experience I had with it are about the many recall capaigns (3 different). I have experienced no significant issue up to now. But since Dec 23 my car use to sit at the dealership cause of a persistent SSN issue.

Basicly the issue happen during charging or when it wakes up for programmed vehicle conditionning. When it fails, the charge ring starts to blink and at that point it is no more possible to start the car. When I try to do it I get the SSN wrench icon every time. The only thing I can do is calling the road assistance and tow the car to the dealership.

This is the fourth(4) time the car gets back to the garage on the towing truck since Dec 23th. The longer period it works in between two failures is 3 days!

Here is the list of all they did on the car up to now:

-Reset a fault code on BECM (Every time there is a "High Voltage insulation" failure code recorded into the BECM)
-Update of all sub-system firmwares
-Changed the 12V battery
-Changed the main drivetrain harness
-Changed the main drivetrain harness a second time (yes!)

Yesterday I got stuck at in the parking beside my work office after having recovered the car since only 24h. It was -15°C outside while waiting the towing truck again... I was a bit discouraged.

This morning I decided to call Ford Canada customer's service. I spoke with a very kind person but she can't really help me anymore because she tells that "it is out of its competence". I told her that it is probably the reason why I am calling them! As a result, the customer's service manager is supposed to call me back in a few days... I am waiting his call.

In my opinion, there is not only one problem but many. The main problem is the issue with the car of course, but I don't believe that it is necessarily a bad car. Rather than that the major problem seems to be the poor knowledge and the few experience of the technical staff with this product combined with a lack of technical support from the manufacturer.

Anyway, I'll keep you informed about any further development.

Questions: Does anybody has ever experienced the "BECM - High voltage insulation" fault?

 

[rcmager]

After 2.5 years and almost 20,000 miles, we got the dreaded SSNW. My wife was driving home on the freeway (half charge, nothing unusual), stop and go traffic, middle lane, was stopped and traffic started moving. She pressed on the go pedal and nothing happened. There was the SSNW light. She put the blinkers on, called CHP and suffered the honks and middle finger salutes from drivers going around her. As if sitting in the middle of freeway traffic was her idea of fun. CHP pushed her off to the side, and a quick response tow truck towed her off the causeway. Ford towed the car to Downtown Ford in Sacramento. They had it for two days, did a software update on it to "energize a couple of modules" that weren't operating right. They charged it a couple of times, drove it, recharged it, test drove it again and declared it fit for me. I am a bit apprehensive but will drive it. Ford HAS GOT TO GET THIS FIXED.
Oh yeah, before the tow truck came from Ford Roadside Assistance, we tried to start it, and it turned on. Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?

 

[jmueller065]

rcmager: Did you ever take it in to get the SSN recall service performed?

 

[v_traveller]

Unfortunately I have a follow-up to my 1/27 post above....

Took the FFE in on 2/7 to get all the recalls done. The recall work did not seem to fix the sluggishness that I noticed immediately after the SSN, which was an indicator to me that perhaps the root cause of my SSN is yet to be discovered.

This morning I got another SSN. Fortunately I was only a block from home. This time, I didn't need to cycle power off and then on to try to start. After the SSN, subsequent pushes of the start button were all interpreted as an attempt to power up, and each press resulted in another SSN. So I opened and closed the driver door, then pressed the start button, and got the little green car on the dashboard to light up. Although relieved, I was really pissed off. Made a u-turn, parked it in the driveway, and took off in the Volt.

Looks like another trip to the dealer this weekend. For those in the LA area, any recommendations on a dealership that knows how to handle a SSN issue that's not related to the recall?

 

[sefs]

Unfortunately, as the many pages of this post make apparent, there are many different things that can cause SSN. It is my opinion that many of these do not get fixed, or are unable to be diagnosed due to the way Ford trains its service staff. I've taken the FFE service training, and it's lacking to say the least. The diagnostic steps in the service manual also don't go far enough to find the root cause of issues. There are places that the service tech is not advised to enter, but can yield a lot of information on what is causing the issue. There are so many little high voltage interlock (HVIL) circuits all over the car that have tiny wiring susceptible to breakdown. If any of these start to open circuit, the whole car will shut down with a SSN. If the insulation measured by the BECM is marginal, it can cause an intermittent SSN. It's my opinion that these two failure modes are causing the majority of SSN episodes post-recall. Personally, I've had SSN errors appear, but this was due to my own tinkering while parked in my garage. I have the IDS software to reset as I see fit. For what it's worth, if I ever got a SSN on the road, I'd have my wife bring me my laptop to diagnose it myself. As an EE who works with propulsion inverters all the time, there isn't that much that can go wrong that can't be found. I don't have the same faith in my friendly neighborhood Ford dealer. I wish all you guys didn't live in SoCal, or I'd gladly lend a hand!

 

[v_traveller]

Thanks sefs... too bad we don't live near each other, I could use your help!

I decided to drive the FFE to work today, and guess what... I got the SSN again, this time on the freeway in the exact conditions of the first SSN (stop and go traffic). In fact, the failure occurred within a half mile of where the first SSN popped up. I was still able to drive after the SSN, and this time since I knew what to expect I was able to drive it into the breakdown lane before coming to a complete stop. Didn't have to get out and push it.

This time I immediately opened/shut the driver's door and pressed the start button, but it wouldn't start. Tried that a couple of times. Finally worked after about 30 seconds. So now I'm thinking that for the failure that I'm experiencing, there's some timeout period that has to pass before pressing the start button will actually start the car, and anything done prior to that has no effect. Next time it happens I'll try just waiting one minute or so before pressing the start button rather than repeating the open door / close door / press start button ritual until the green car on the dash lights up.

I'm driving the FFE again tomorrow, we'll see what happens. Still haven't decided whether or not I want it to fail. Probably not, since I have a meeting first thing in the morning. One common condition between the three SSNs is that I was coasting at about 10mph in "L" when it occurred... I'm thinking that starting tomorrow I'll drive in "D" and see if I still get a SSN. If not, I'll keep doing that for a couple of weeks, then switch back to driving in "L" to see if the SSN comes back.

 

[redcelt007]

A new TSB just came out today on the Motorcraft Service website. The TSB is 15-0031 and involves getting DTC P0A0A:01. This refers to a connection issue with the high voltage interlock near the battery pack. If your dealer has not addressed this issue, I would take it to them asap and have them check it. I had this problem occur on my 2014 FFE before the TSB came out.

 

[v_traveller]

Thanks, redcelt007! Is there a link to the TSB online? I'd like to print it out and give it to the service advisor. How long did they have your FFE when you had your SSN?

I haven't gone to the dealer yet.... not in a rush since driving in "D" instead of "L" seems to have eliminated the SSN issue for now. But I'd like to get it fixed sooner than later.

 

[redcelt007]

The Motorcraft site is subscription based. You can subscribe for 1 month for about 20.00. I don't know if I'm allowed to post things from their website. Let me see what I can do. You should be able to give the dealer that TSB # and they can look it up. I had originally taken my FFE in for a brake warning light problem. While in the shop they discovered the problem with that high voltage interlink. My car was in the shop for about 3 weeks while they waited for parts. This happened during one of those bad snowstorms, so shipping was slow.

 

[sefs]

A new TSB just came out today on the Motorcraft Service website. The TSB is 15-0031 and involves getting DTC P0A0A:01. This refers to a connection issue with the high voltage interlock near the battery pack. If your dealer has not addressed this issue, I would take it to them asap and have them check it. I had this problem occur on my 2014 FFE before the TSB came out.

It's not near the battery pack, it's under the hood at the High Voltage Junction Box.

 

[redcelt007]

My mistake. Confused it with another connector.

 

[v_traveller]

Thanks, redcelt007 and cefs! You guys rock!

Plan is to take it to the dealer at the end of the month during spring break, TSB # in hand.

 

[rcmager]

Got another SSN. I have been driving it okay for about a month since my wife got stuck in the middle of the freeway during rush hour traffic. Dealer updated software, reflashed some modules and test drove it a couple of times. Seemed okay. She hasn't driven it since except to the grocery store. But it stopped again on her real near our house. She waited a couple of minutes and the car started. Drove it home and Ford towed it to Downtown Ford in Sacramento. I've had enough.
I'm going to work to get out of my lease. I REALLY loved this car, but randomly stopping is not an option.

 

[hybridbear]

Got another SSN. I have been driving it okay for about a month since my wife got stuck in the middle of the freeway during rush hour traffic. Dealer updated software, reflashed some modules and test drove it a couple of times. Seemed okay. She hasn't driven it since except to the grocery store. But it stopped again on her real near our house. She waited a couple of minutes and the car started. Drove it home and Ford towed it to Downtown Ford in Sacramento. I've had enough.
I'm going to work to get out of my lease. I REALLY loved this car, but randomly stopping is not an option.

What year is your FFE?

 

[wjs]

I have a 2014 FFE and had 3 SSN events (all in parking lots). Dealer replaced high voltage wiring harness. After that, no further SSN's but started having yellow wrench lights virtually every time I drove the car. No other symptoms but unnerving, never the less. Dealer has now had the vehicle for almost 3 weeks. They replaced the electric motor. I am on the way to picking up the car now. Fingers crossed!!

 

[hybridbear]

I have a 2014 FFE and had 3 SSN events (all in parking lots). Dealer replaced high voltage wiring harness. After that, no further SSN's but started having yellow wrench lights virtually every time I drove the car. No other symptoms but unnerving, never the less. Dealer has now had the vehicle for almost 3 weeks. They replaced the electric motor. I am on the way to picking up the car now. Fingers crossed!!

How'd it go? All better?

 

[wjs]

After 3 weeks at the dealer and having the electric motor replaced, I have the car back and, so far, no further problems. The dealer says they are trying to get Ford to reimburse me for one month's lease payment but I am not holding my breath. Meanwhile, I think the only original major electric component left is the battery.

 

[jeffand]

Ford needs to develop better trouble shooting methods on the FFE. You should be able to go to the dealership one time to find out whats wrong. It's like they are doing a guessing game as to what is the problem. To solve this problem Ford would have an expert that know the cars electrical systems like the back of his hand. These technicians would get specialized training from the Ford enginers that designed the car. Ford would supply the FFE owners with a loaner FFE until thier car is repaired. I think one of the problems is you have mechanics working on electronics. What Ford is doing is they are asking a mechanic to do something that is outside of thier expertice.

 

[NightHawk]

I would expect an onboard diagnostics system so that when a SSN occurs it could display at that time on the display exactly what caused the fault, no guessing!
I would think that would save Ford lots of money to avoid unnecessary large item replacements that may not be the cause of the fault.